The mess that is the JVN translation scene

[DaFool]

I've been inspired to make this post after reading this interview (as well as the previous interview referenced in the article), and especially the comments later directed at Peter Payne.

http://www.siliconera.com/2012/01/17/ja ... nitroplus/

I'm posting in this VN forum because I feel the topic is a bit high-level and kinda controversial.

So basically Peter Payne admits working with Japanese companies are a pain to deal with... and when selling to westerners you need lower prices. The most popular JVN companies are practically untouchable for the most part.

It has often been cited that the best-selling JVNs by Mangagamer and JAST sell less than 1000 copies. Whereas jack_norton and papillon often admit to a game or two now and then breaking that barrier.

Now here's the clincher of my theory. I know that in my country at least, it's easier to import and dub Korean dramas and Japanese animation since it's often cheaper than making your own production. Now, what if...
Making your own visual novel and selling it is cheaper, causes less headache, and produces more profit (percentagewise) than dealing with a Japanese company?

Why do I find that idea intriguing?
- visual novels have huge amounts of texts. Paying a professional translator's rate would practically cost thousands of dollars... money which could technically be used towards funding a few artists on deviantart to make event CGs. No wonder JAST/mangagamer are always on the hunt for "cheap" fantranslations.
- if people, especially in this economy, are only willing to pay for $10 (or at most $20) games, then what's the point of selling $39.99 games? Based on my experience with the few full-length visual novels that I read, most of that experience is plain filler... text that doesn't even satisfy as much as a paperback novel would. And the only way to make $10 or 10 Euro games is by making OELVNs, even if it means recycling some assets (Hello Go! Go! Nippon)
- Most JVNs are 18+ and so are automatically niche. The few that break into the console space cannot be localized because of stupid companies like Sony (no visual novels on PS3 in western markets). I consider the recent mini-renaissance on PSP as sort of an anomaly.

The turning point in this situation is if indeed a miracle happens and a massive non-18+ game like Steins Gate is able to be featured on Steam and pave the way just like Recettear paved the way for doujin games.

But assuming a worst case scenario... what if some group comes out with a visual novel that looks and feels and plays like a JVN except that it was originally written in English? In fact that is one of the challenges now that I'm tackling at Neko-Soft... to make the art and interface and music so Japanese-feeling, you can interchange it with Go! Go! Nippon and you wouldn't see the difference.

And then... what would happen?

[Hime]

[mikey]

[DaFool]

Hime, you make some very good points.

You made me realize JAST/JLIST essentially is a company that caters to Japanophiles (or made in Japan only elitists). Nevermind that there are non-Japanese in the fandom (some manwha authors and Taiwanese such as vofan), the whole principle is to specifically be from Japan.

Thus the dividing line separating JVNs and EVNs that will never be crossed regardless of how close (or far) to JVNs EVNs will evolve.

It still doesn't change the fact that the JVN scene is an uphill battle against stubborn Japanese companies, pirating fanboys who want everything for free, and translators with their own quirks and agendas and personal motives. Steins Gate, being the next Ever-17 like non-18+ caliber visual novel to be prominent outside of Japan for a while, will indeed be the bellweather for the scene just like Katawa Shoujo was for the EVNs. It will be interesting to see how it pans out.

The JVN companies themselves stifled some international potential when right after the Rapelay fiasco they blocked foreign ips and became increasingly xenophobic. The last thing visual novels need is to be associated with porn games (although I do enjoy those things myself). What should be leading the VN scene should be console style VNs such as Phoenix Wright and 999. The problem is that most JVN proponents would rather stick to their loli crying games.

edit: Not to mention it's a race against the clock, since Japanophiles only care about what's currently popular in Japan. Once Japan says that something new is now popular, then that's only going to spell slower sales for any projects still in translation.

[DaFool]

My gosh, Aaeru is making me facepalm so hard. A shame because Fuwanovel is a really cute and welcoming site by design, unlike novelnews/gemot.

Here's the thing: true Japanophile Japan-only elitists will go "1.) Learn Japanese 2.) Bypass crooked western middlement like JAST and import directly from Japan, giving your money to the creators".

So by that logic, any westerner trying to get into the localization business will be screwed, if all of a sudden all Japanese companies decide to make dual-language releases standard. The only reason they're so hesitant is because of the content which will not pass muster no thanks in part to the Rapelay incident. The only advantage western localization companies have is generally
1.) they make the English flow much much better
2.) they adapt to lower prices

What would be interesting is if in the midst of "oh whoa is the VN medium it's so niche" all of a sudden, due to the collapse of the manga and comics industry, many comic artists start self-publishing digitally as digital motion comics which in all intents and purposes are kinetic novels. And if story-based interactive games make a comeback as well, thanks in part to artists and writers uniting and figuring out the new digital economy while barely knowing any programming.

[Angra Mainyu]

[Hime]

[sake-bento]

In general, fans here seem content to spend less money on a shorter VN, so I don't even feel like I'm in direct competition with JVNs. Maybe that's just me? I've never broken the magical 1000 sales barrier, but I have no doubt that if I tried to sell a 30 hour VN for $50, I wouldn't sell anywhere close to as much as what I'm selling now. So in the end, I'd say making a JVN-like game in English remains more expensive than actual translation. Things might change if the market for EVNs increases, though.

[mikey]